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V7.2 HARD RIDE AND TYRES

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Bethspeedy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bethspeedy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 May 2018 at 21:51
TANK SLAPPER BEWARE!

I’ve been riding V7ii Racer for the past 2 years and 8500 miles, love qwerks and all but get the tyres changed when the white linking and weaving starts or reap the scary slapper moment!

The original Pirelli Demons were ok but after 4000miles they are doing the shimmy over ripples. Changed them for Dunlop Street Smarts and they were great at first but after 3000 miles they were doing the same dance! Coming back from Helmsley I rode over a bit of a ridge in the road at 70 and I went into a massive tank slapper for about 3 seconds but managed to stay on and eventually it came out of it! 

I got the tyres changed for BT45s and now it’s behaving it’s self again! 

After reading a lot of others experiencing the white lining, I wanted to pass my bum puckering moment and say don’t leave it and get the rubber changed!

Got some Hagon shocks ordered so hopefully improve the rear.

I think Moto Guzzi need to get this sorted!! This could have killed me and because of just road legal tyres!



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Brian UK View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 May 2018 at 22:22
Out of interest, what pressures do you use front and back?
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Bethspeedy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bethspeedy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 2018 at 09:24
I’ve played with 32psi and 36psi front and back and they all have the same affect
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Alan Sbj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jun 2018 at 18:04
I am looking at changing the fork internals on my V7 Mk 2, as a 6’  14 stoner, I was thinking of refilling with sae 10 oil when I do this.
I have purchased some Bitubo internals in an effort to stiffen up the front end and stop the forks from bottoming out and giving that “spongy” feeling.
Anyone got any thoughts ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jefrs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2018 at 14:23
At 18+stone I find softer forks work better than hard sporty ones. This is on the damping, the spring rate is usually fine. The heavier the load the more the forks 'thud' over bumps, the constant jarring can get tiresome. 

I recently had the fork oil replaced on my 3yo Enfield EFI, with SAE.5, which is the stock oil on that.
Whereas the forks were 'crashy' before they are now perfect.  Perhaps surprisingly the Enfield has better forks than my Guzzi V7ii, 42mm forks, progressive springs and dual rate damping.

Fork oil does not last all that long, what came out was quite filthy. Simply putting good new oil in cured the problem. 
The 3yo V7ii forks are feeling a bit crashy, it probably wants fresh fork oil too.
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jefrs View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jefrs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2018 at 14:37
Originally posted by Bethspeedy Bethspeedy wrote:

I’ve played with 32psi and 36psi front and back and they all have the same affect


Tyre pressure depends on brand-model of tyre, not just the bike.

On the V7ii the Pirelli Speed Demons want to be F36/F37psi
With Avon Roadrider (which are considered an upgrade to BT45) F33/R36 +2/+2 for pillion and 0/+2 more for heavy luggage.
Being quite heavy I am like putting a pillion aboard by myself and add that +2/+2 for me, and another +2/+2 for pillion.

The Roadriders have good wet grip, as in they actually grip and don't skip about on dry roads neither, unlike the Pirelli, much safer and more confident tyre, and have a higher speed rating. 
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jefrs View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jefrs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2018 at 15:00
Originally posted by Alan Sbj Alan Sbj wrote:

I am looking at changing the fork internals on my V7 Mk 2, as a 6’  14 stoner, I was thinking of refilling with sae 10 oil when I do this.
I have purchased some Bitubo internals in an effort to stiffen up the front end and stop the forks from bottoming out and giving that “spongy” feeling.
Anyone got any thoughts ?
 

I'm like 4-stone heavier and I cannot bottom out the forks. The damping will thud but they're not hitting the bottom of travel. The damping needs to be smoother, softer not harder, so it doesn't stop spring travel so suddenly.  

The V7ii forks do not have dual-rate damping and progressive springs. They are single rate damping and simple springs. If the spring rate is too hard suspension can feel like riding a pogo stick on the rebound if it is not damped well.
All the replacement spring/damper kits I've looked at are on the sporty side. Race shocks are very solid; race bikes ride on billiard table surfaces, I ride on british roads with surfaces described as diabolical at best. The V7ii is not a sports bike. Personally I prefer a comfortable ride than having my eyeballs loosened.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andyb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2018 at 19:59
Suspension is always a bit difficult to quantify....
At 80kg with helmet and suit I am not that heavy and my standard 2014 Stone suspension was too heavily damped.  I almost lost it on a road in the Peak District which had ripples: the rear went rigid and bounced sideways.

I now have Hagon Nitros with 18kg springs at the rear and SAE4 Aeroshell at the front (Kaifa forks).  When I changed the fork fluid one leg had 320ml of oil, the other 280ml.  Luigi got the average about right

That combination, now with a Pirelli Scorpion Trail 2 radial on the rear works well for me but the Hagons took maybe 1000 miles to bed in and loosen off.  Radial tyres to me are the way forward - better grip, comfortable and they seem to last longer than bias tyres.

I think Guzzis will always have slightly stiff rear ends - the shaft drive is heavy and slow to move when hitting a bump.

Andyb



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jefrs View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jefrs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 2018 at 23:41
I found the rear end of both the V7iii and V7ii skipped sideways in the dry on Pirellis during demo test rides in the dry.  The front skittered under (heavy test) braking causing the ABS to kick in.  I've have so many faults with Pirelli trying to kill me that that I will not have them fitted.

My V7ii is on Roadriders, they don't skip sideways and do grip in the wet. Braking distance is much reduced. And they wear well too, I'll be unhappy if I don't get 20,000 miles out of them. 

Roadrider and Speed Demon and BT45 are bias-ply. The V7 wants a fairly high profile. Radial usually have softer sidewalls and want a lower profile to prevent the tyre deforming by 'rolling' sideways.

My 18+stone can't bottom out the stock shocks on the lowest setting. I like soft but they were a bit too soft then; so raised about 1cm.  With the nuts raised about an inch, I couldn't get it to bottom-out 2-up (heavy).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote motopete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 13:40
Originally posted by jefrs jefrs wrote:

I found the rear end of both the V7iii and V7ii skipped sideways in the dry on Pirellis during demo test rides in the dry.  The front skittered under (heavy test) braking causing the ABS to kick in.  I've have so many faults with Pirelli trying to kill me that that I will not have them fitted.

I find it a bit strange reading some of these posts since my V7 II has Sport Demons and stock suspension, and apart from the over-stiff compression damping I find the grip and handling really good.
Comfort's not so good on rough roads, but good enough for 250 - 300 miles with no aches or pains.

Perhaps I'm lucky and my weight happens to suit the standard set up? I'm just under 11 stone and only ride solo with handbook tyre pressures (35F/36R), rear pre-load is around 1/4 - 1/3 of maximum.

I'm impressed by the way it handles unexpected bumps/ruts/sunken drain when I'm cranked over halfway through a bend, it just carries on going exactly where I'm pointing. If I were to summarise the handling I'd say "confidence inspiring".

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote johnno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 19:22
motopete , as you say weight etc all counts plus set up of bike but in your case smoothness is the Ace card 
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jefrs View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jefrs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 20:05
Originally posted by motopete motopete wrote:

Originally posted by jefrs jefrs wrote:

I found the rear end of both the V7iii and V7ii skipped sideways in the dry on Pirellis during demo test rides in the dry.  The front skittered under (heavy test) braking causing the ABS to kick in.  I've have so many faults with Pirelli trying to kill me that that I will not have them fitted.

I find it a bit strange reading some of these posts since my V7 II has Sport Demons and stock suspension, and apart from the over-stiff compression damping I find the grip and handling really good.
Comfort's not so good on rough roads, but good enough for 250 - 300 miles with no aches or pains.

Perhaps I'm lucky and my weight happens to suit the standard set up? I'm just under 11 stone and only ride solo with handbook tyre pressures (35F/36R), rear pre-load is around 1/4 - 1/3 of maximum.

I'm impressed by the way it handles unexpected bumps/ruts/sunken drain when I'm cranked over halfway through a bend, it just carries on going exactly where I'm pointing. If I were to summarise the handling I'd say "confidence inspiring".



Having ridden the other bike for a few years on Roadriders, I was immediately dissatisfied by the stock Sport Demon on both  demo Guzzis. I've had similar slippery problems in the past with Pirelli, and poor wear.
I can't say the handling is any better but if you think the Sport Demon grip well then the Roadrider are like glue, and thus the bike feels far more confident.  Comfort is about the same too except without the twitchy feeling, and I ride some pretty rough roads.  The Roadriders don't squirrel about over ruts and bumps like the Sport Demon. Less drunken cow, more cat on rails. 

I like the suspension fairly soft to aid comfort, and I have short legs, so I lower the ride height - about 1cm from the bottom solo and about an inch up with pillion. We have not managed to bottom-out either of them. Having the back end a bit squishy doesn't affect cornering very much and it does soak up lumps and bumps
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote V7Chris Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 20:33
I found the standard Pirelli sport demons a bit twitchy on white lines etc. No such problems with Conti road attacks although they took a bit of getting used to initially, much slower to turn in until there were a couple of hundred miles on them. I went for these as they were voted the best best for country roads. Wear not much better than the Pirellis though so will need to fit a new set next spring. Might go for Bridgestone as these seem to be highly rated. When I were a lad, riding Jap 250s in the seventies, you changed your Bridgestones for Dunlop or Avons as soon as you could. Things have changed a but since then!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 22:30
Ask 10 people which tyre is best and you normally get at least 13 different answers.

We'll be discussing oil next.

What it comes down to is that everyone will have their own preference. What one thinks is perfect another will hate.
Brian.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BobV7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 23:19
Here, here Brian, and I think we all can agree that tyres in general are a GOOD THING and to be recommended for use in all circumstances.

Now are there any other totally subjective topics that have already been done to death but are apparently worth endlessly rehashing for the benefit of any late comers? Unhappy
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