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User Code and Errors - Breva 1100 ABS

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stu View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 2019 at 16:23
I agree that ridding water is a must I just don't think adding holes is the best way forward even though I've done it myself. I'm Spokes over on GuzziTech. What ever form of attack that's chosen to try to fix the problem though, is better than doing nothing. I think misting and water pooling are two different issues as misting may not be from pooled water, just trapped warm air.

Having reread the GuzziTech thread I'm rather disappointed with myself at removing the hands this time around when previously warned. All I could think about is "this time I'm not putting holes the the dial". We'll see how the hands work once reattached...

My 05 bike is long gone but I hope to keep this one long term so should be able to give long term feedback to any jobs or bodge jobs I do Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tris Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 2019 at 16:31
Originally posted by stu stu wrote:

.......

Only 3 vents appear to be used. The bottom vent is blind, possibly because it's below the outer chrome cover for protection.

.........


"un-blind" it

My clocks misted until l I opened up that vent and never had a problem since

Other people have different views, but I'm convinced that the damage is caused by condensation which is caused by poor ventilation and not by water ingress.

However, for double security I fitted small fish tank tube elbows pointing down on the off chance that water could find its way past the "limp wristed labyrinth seal" on each of the vents

Tris

PS I've just completed major surgery to replace a dead/dying LCD and used the pull and twist technique to remove the needles and they all appear to work OK, but I'll be sure once I go for a ride


Edited by Tris - 06 Mar 2019 at 16:50
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 2019 at 17:53
Originally posted by stu stu wrote:

I think misting and water pooling are two different issues as misting may not be from pooled water, just trapped warm air.

I think the misting can eventually pool in the bottom of the unit.
Brian.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 2019 at 18:49
Just waiting on bits from eBay prior to reassembly and will post a video of the process for reference and comment here.

Can't say I'm looking forward to it. Glad you manage to remove and replace the needles Tris as that's the job I'm dreading.

Should be fun.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar 2019 at 15:20
The first of a couple of three videos of the Dashboard.

This first video just shows the dashboard in bit, components with maybe some tips, who knows.

Remember I'm not a pro but I'll include as much info as I can so you can make your own judgement.

Also, the reason for taking these clocks apart was the issue with electronics that seamed to happen after or during rain, with evidence of misting in the clocks showing the possibility of water ingress. This proved correct when users took apart their clock.

My opinion is that there are quite a few possible entry points for water to get inside the clock.

Anyway, here's the first vid (30mins long - Sorry in advanced Tongue ):

 

PS. Later video for test shows clocks are OK and working so far...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar 2019 at 16:49
Connecting the PCB to the LCD and white plastic housing.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar 2019 at 17:24
Some images to show some details missing from the video.

This image shows one of the needle spindles with the four soldered points that showed signs of corrosion.



This side is hidden under the dial. Each spindle has these connectors.

The next images show cracks in the case. Possibly done whilst I was separating the body parts. Possibly down to environmental deterioration and vibrations to the plastic. Either way, they're there now.





So whilst checking your dash, look for these cracks...

This next image is the well I referred to in the video which may hold water under the seal ~ not sure. It's located just to the left of the LCD.



Last image is of the Silicone coating. Only just visible. I may use this or similar to coat and seal the inside of the case, watching not to seal the vent holes. Both sides were done. Care taken not to coat thing I didn't think I should. Up to you.



My main priority is not to make thing worse. Parts are hard to get but I think I've read that Tris has mentioned alternative dashboards.

Last video of the test is on it's way.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar 2019 at 17:44
I think the case is made from ABS. If so then you can get a bottle of Plastic Weld from model shops or online.
Put a drop along the crack, it seeps in and chemically welds the crack up. End product is almost invisible and as strong as the original.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar 2019 at 17:45
The following is a quote from bryair.com article "Electronic corrosion can occur due to several reasons"

"The most common reason for electronic break down is subversive environmental conditions and contaminants found in the environment. This contaminants include fine and coarse particles such as chlorides, sulfates, sodium, ammonium, potassium, magnesium, and calcium. These are elements found in almost all types of environment, meaning no electronic device is ever totally safe. Although these are all present in a variety of environments, the single most important environmental condition is the relative humidity of the environment. With a higher humidity, the more these previously mentioned particles are going to affect the electronic device. The effect of the coarse particles on the electronic device can be extremely detrimental, causing malfunction by interrupting electrical contact between partner pairs of connectors or relays."

And here's the first Test video of the clocks. It's just a quick test. Use testing to 0 needles. I've fuel in my tank so fuel gauge has a none 0 reading. Not sure how to fool the gauge to empty or calibrate other than after it's initial sweep then key off, needle should be at 0.



Might get to ride it again soon Embarrassed
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar 2019 at 17:46
Thanks Brian, will look into that and feedback Big smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 11:34
Spent most of this morning musing over whether I should set fire to a small piece of my dashboard casing to check if it's ABS plastic. The small piece does sink in water but I need to be sure.

Turns out it is ABS as it says so on the casting. Gosh! I'm thick! Embarrassed

Anyhoo. Concerns about the cracks and breaks whilst dismantling the perspex from the lower case have finally found a solution that's more than likely already widely used. Suckers!



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 19:42
The cracks, fractures and breaks to the grey casing have all now been fixed (subject to testing by use).

Before: Gutter fracture


After: Gutter Fracture healed. Allow EMA to flow backwards and forwards, rocking motion.


After Brian's tip earlier with ABS and liquid weld, I did a little research (Youtube) and chose some products for the job. EMA Plastic Weld, Extra Strong Cross Weave Fibreglass Reinforced Packing Tape (25mm) and some E6000 Glue that didn't get used.



The plastic weld is a bit like water and I applied with a syringe (that wasn't affected by the EMA).

If sticking a broken piece, I'd bead a small amount on some glass and dip the broken ABS plastic piece into it, then locate it in position.



I didn't have a suitable paint brush at hand to use as an applicator. However, using the syringe to apply small amounts of EMA and rocking the plastic casing, allowing the liquid weld to flow over the job where needed worked well and the liquid didn't work aggressively which gave time to flow. Some of the screw threads in the gutter may need tapping out after EMA contact but possibly Vaseline or grease preping may help protect areas. Both sides of the cracks were treated and slight pulling on the gutter in various places to check for hairline or invisible breaks.

The Packing Tape was applied to where the cracks and breaks were (25mm wide) with the excess folded over into the gutter. You may just see some runs where the EMA flowed by accident, no harm.



EMA was applied again over the tape and at joins. An EMA bead was applied to the base and gutter allowing to flow over the joints by rocking, seamed to seal the tape. The addition of tape didn't prevent the insertion of the clocks.



Next is the rubber seal, something like Shore A20 2mm compressible to 1-1.5mm may work.

Thanks again for the tips and suggestions peeps. Smile


Edited by stu - 13 Mar 2019 at 19:45
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 22:04
This must be the second weekend that the Dashboard has been in pieces. However, this time has given me a chance to look things over, think, test and make boo-boos.

Putting the lens in place with a home made seal made from a 2mm thick (wish I got 3mm) sheet of neoprene sponge rubber.



No internals for a clear view, showed stresses in the gutter where the screws were and a crack that I hadn't seen previously. The casting also showed extra cracks from the underside of the grey case where the screw shafts go. Really don't know if I'd created them whilst the lens was off and the screws were inserted too far in. Maybe worth checking.



An under the tap rain test from the top made me question the 3 open vent holes underneath and now two have been sealed leaving only the top open. The blue circle shows the factory sealed vent.



I used duct putty for this and also used it to fill the void in the gutter bottom left. Then covered the putty with a dab of Flexible Silicone Coating (FSC) which I had previously used on the PCB.





I've repaired the newly found crack and covered it and the screw location areas with fibreglass packing tape for a bit more strength.



I'll leave fastening it all down until I know the needles are correctly zeroed.

It's a good job I don't charge myself by the hour.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 05:22
Clocks are back on the bike now.

Just a few things I've noticed or did wrong.

1. Needle position. If removing needles make a note of their stop positions (they sweep around 3/4 of a full turn). Reason being when altering my Gear Change Light RPM, it didn't quite match Needle RPM. By this time I'd fastened the case down. Even though I'd zeroed with ignition. Same goes with speedo. Maybe a trial run and match speed.

2. Yeh, I'm sure there was something else...

Anyhoo, I'll let you know how the clocks fair after a year or two, sooner if they don't fair too well!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 17:56
Last video and post I promise until I have some results on the long-term test of the dashboard. Tongue 

Basic pre checks before final assembly and fitting.


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