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New Guzzi owner and member

Printed From: guzziriders.org - moto guzzi forum
Category: Introduction
Forum Name: Introduce yourself
Forum Description: Make yourself known.
URL: http://www.guzziriders.org/forum_posts.asp?TID=9325
Printed Date: 16 Dec 2018 at 03:19
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.00 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: New Guzzi owner and member
Posted By: Theomarakas
Subject: New Guzzi owner and member
Date Posted: 07 Oct 2018 at 22:37
I went to service my Aprilia Tuono and rode out in a 2017 V-9 Bobber. It took me about 250 miles to understand the bike, at first I tried riding it like a superbike because that's what I've been riding for the last 20 years. Then there was a revelation....you can actually have fun on a bike doing 60 mph instead of 160 mph. 
I have the bike for about a month, I still have my 3 Aprilias and KTM but I mostly ride the Moto Guzzi. Riding it makes me feel more distinguished, calm and civilized. Obviously, you can't ride a Tuono the way you ride a Moto Guzzi, The Tuono front tire barely has any contact with the ground.
I have bought already every accessory with the exception of the side panniers, and in the process of replacing every bolt with either stainless or titanium. I absolutely dislike zinc coated industrial looking bolts. BAAK motorcycles has awesome bits and pieces, and the OEM catalogue a few more. However, there isn't much from the aftermarket on these V9 bikes, maybe they haven't sold enough to motivate the aftermarket to produce some bling?
There are a few British companies that sell stainless bolts and bolt kits but NOTHING for the V9. I'm sure the V7 II and III and V9 share some of those nuts and bolts but the information on the internet is limited. 
My impression on these bikes is either you understand it or you simply don't. No middle ground. Thankfully, I do understand it and treat it for what it is. Madly in love with it already, I never buy anything that I don't like or short term. 
Well, Hello my fellow riders, thank you for the opportunity to introduce myself. Cheers.


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The "goose"



Replies:
Posted By: BobV7
Date Posted: 07 Oct 2018 at 23:04
A warm welcome to you sir, and you join an increasing number Guzzi owners from your side of the Pond who have found a home on this side. Hope you enjoy it and find it useful.Hug

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V7 Classic Black and gold is the best colour


Posted By: johnno
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 05:29
Hi and welcome Thumbs Up

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GSXR1100 L ,Moto Guzzi .750xpa,.1100 sport,1100 sport corsa rider


Posted By: helmetbolt
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 07:05
Hello, and welcome to the forum.

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2001 California Special. (Modified)


Posted By: Barry
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 08:16
Hello and welcome!


Posted By: jpc
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 08:37
Stainless fasteners are a great way to enhance the quality and looks of your bike.

I'm not aware of existing "kits" for Guzzis but you can compile your own personal list and rely partly on what's available at DIY stores (the A2 stamping guarantees the quality), and for more elusive sizes, nylocks and washers, on some firms that take orders for reasonably small quantities like this one:  https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/index.html" rel="nofollow - https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/index.html

I often get comments on how "clean" my 39 year-old T3 looks, I think much of it is due to there being not a single dull or rusted fastener on it (it works hard and is not always that clean...).

Enjoy your Guzzi !


Posted By: Dave P.
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 09:36
If you are replacing a high tensile bolt then A4 80 is the grade to use. It is, in fact, a high tensile stainless steel.

https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/ScrewBolt_M.html" rel="nofollow - https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/ScrewBolt_M.html

You can check out the different material grades above.

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TO LIVE OUTSIDE THE LAW YOU MUST BE HONEST.

1971 V7 Special. 1972 850GT.
1970 T120 Bonnie. 2009 500 Bullet.


Posted By: jpc
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 10:54
Originally posted by Dave P. Dave P. wrote:

If you are replacing a high tensile bolt then A4 80 is the grade to use. It is, in fact, a high tensile stainless steel.

https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/ScrewBolt_M.html" rel="nofollow - https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/ScrewBolt_M.html

You can check out the different material grades above.

That's an interesting distinction I was not aware of.
I used A2 throughout, the most stressed being probably the brake caliper bolts, with no issue (so far).
If A4 80 is equivalent to 8.8, how do you know what threshold it's required at ?
Are there tables based on tightening torque ? I can't find any...


Posted By: Dave P.
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 14:50
Is this what you're after?

https://www.fastenal.com/content/feds/pdf/Torque%20of%20Metric%20Stainless%20Steel.pdf" rel="nofollow - https://www.fastenal.com/content/feds/pdf/Torque%20of%20Metric%20Stainless%20Steel.pdf

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TO LIVE OUTSIDE THE LAW YOU MUST BE HONEST.

1971 V7 Special. 1972 850GT.
1970 T120 Bonnie. 2009 500 Bullet.


Posted By: jpc
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 15:13
Not quite.

This applies to BOTH A2 and A4, but how do you decide which one is required, was my question.

It looks like the cost of one is twice that of the other, I'm wondering if the extra cost is justified in motorcycle applications and if so, where ?

Just wondering Ermm 




Posted By: BobV7
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 15:36
I could be wrong about this but I had the impression that A2 is a general all round construction standard and A4 is more corrosion resistant suitable for use in marine environments. Could be totally wrong as no doubt someone will be eager to point out!Wink

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V7 Classic Black and gold is the best colour


Posted By: Dave P.
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 15:44
https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/ScrewBolt_M.html      It's all here Bob.

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TO LIVE OUTSIDE THE LAW YOU MUST BE HONEST.

1971 V7 Special. 1972 850GT.
1970 T120 Bonnie. 2009 500 Bullet.


Posted By: jpc
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 16:06
Originally posted by BobV7 BobV7 wrote:

I could be wrong about this but I had the impression that A2 is a general all round construction standard and A4 is more corrosion resistant suitable for use in marine environments. Could be totally wrong as no doubt someone will be eager to point out!Wink

That's exactly what I understand from marine sites, but the strength seems to differ too.

Probably akin to the difference between regular aluminium and tempered marine "anticorrodal", "dural", "avialu", WHY...


Posted By: BobV7
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 17:36
I seem to remember bolts having 8.8 stamped on the head which I think related to their tensile strength? So swapping like for like should be a safe bet, unless a customiser wants to polish the markings off!

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V7 Classic Black and gold is the best colour


Posted By: nab301
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 19:55
Originally posted by Theomarakas Theomarakas wrote:

Then there was a revelation....you can actually have fun on a bike doing 60 mph instead of 160 mph. 


Welcome  !  I couldn't agree more !


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Nigel
Keep smiling , it makes people wonder what you've been up to!
'04 Breva 750, '99 Bmw R1100S, '06 Triumph Bonneville '05 CBF 250, '03Bullet 65 500, '93 MZ301 Saxon fun


Posted By: Brian UK
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2018 at 22:39
The difference between A2 and A4 stainless is it's ability to withstand corrosion. A4 is normally specified in marine applicatins.

A2 and A4 does not refer to the tensile strength of the material.


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Brian.

Better 5 minutes late in this world than years early in the next.


Posted By: Dave P.
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 09:07
Originally posted by Brian UK Brian UK wrote:

The difference between A2 and A4 stainless is it's ability to withstand corrosion. A4 is normally specified in marine applicatins.

A2 and A4 does not refer to the tensile strength of the material.


Quite so. The number following the A2 or A4 specification, ie 70 or 80, for example, denotes the tensile strength. Hence a bolt specified as being of A4 80 standard is a high tensile, highly corrosion resistant bolt. Simples

-------------
TO LIVE OUTSIDE THE LAW YOU MUST BE HONEST.

1971 V7 Special. 1972 850GT.
1970 T120 Bonnie. 2009 500 Bullet.


Posted By: jpc
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 09:28
But leaves unanswered the question: What application requires "high tensile strength" ? Smile


Posted By: BobV7
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 10:09
I think you need to remember that maybe only a very few on this forum will have any recognised advanced technical qualifications! All design engineers will have at their disposal reams of S.A.E. data relating to which materials and fasteners are required to perform a specific purpose. I ain't got any of that and I seriously doubt if anyone else on here has. After all, this forum is probably composed of lads and lassies in a shed with a set of spanners and a lump of metal that they occasionally feel a strange urge to dismantle. You are asking the wrong people my dear chap, so get you to your local technical seat of learning for enlightenment!Wink

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V7 Classic Black and gold is the best colour


Posted By: jpc
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 11:02
I think you're selling it short Bob. Some people here know more about some things than I do, is my idea, or I wouldn't bother.

Simples, as well  Wink


Posted By: Brian UK
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 11:18
Well I admit I have no technical qualification in the tensile strength of bolts, however I do posess the ability to look it up.
Plenty of information around online provided you look at technical sites and not rely on the "accuracies" on facebook. (That should of course read Innacuracies).


-------------
Brian.

Better 5 minutes late in this world than years early in the next.


Posted By: BobV7
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 11:53
I wasn't making a disparaging comment about forum members knowledge but some folk get paid good money to do that sort of stuff for a living, and if the rest of us don't fall into that group then we just are interested amateurs.

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V7 Classic Black and gold is the best colour


Posted By: Android
Date Posted: 09 Oct 2018 at 15:36
there are roughly three tensile grades of steel bolts generally used ...in laymans terms......
these numbers are usually impressed into the head of the fastener.
 
8.8 is your B&Q general hard ware store jobby
 
10.9 is tougher
 
12.9 is the dogs dodahs .....caliper bolts, high tensile Capheads with rolled threads and forged heads


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You can't buy happiness,
But can buy a bike and that's pretty close!
Moto Guzzi 1200 Sport


Posted By: Griffic
Date Posted: 10 Oct 2018 at 22:44
Hello and welcome to the forum.
As an ex-metallurgist in the auto industry my suggestion on high tensile bolts is to look for the strength marking on the head of the bolt i.e 8.8, 10.9, 12.9 etc and replace it with the equivalent grade stainless bolt i.e. replace 8.8 with grade 80. It is not always wise to go for a higher grade assuming more tensile strength is better. A higher grade bolt will have greater tensile strength but will be less tough, ( more brittle.) Although a 8.8 bolt has a lower tensile strength (800 N/mm2) than a 12.9 bolt (1200 N/mm2) it’s impact strength at at 30 Joules is double that of a 12.9 bolt. Higher strength bolts  such as 12.9 grade are also more prone to suffer sudden catastrophic failure due to hydrogen embrittlement and are not used by some car manufacturers for this reason. 


Posted By: George S
Date Posted: 10 Oct 2018 at 23:17
That is very interesting. Changing to higher strength is not always better 
Like buying high performance bike when your brain is only low performance. Nothing but trouble 


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George


Posted By: BobV7
Date Posted: 11 Oct 2018 at 10:40
Originally posted by Griffic Griffic wrote:

Hello and welcome to the forum.
As an ex-metallurgist in the auto industry my suggestion on high tensile bolts is to look for the strength marking on the head of the bolt i.e 8.8, 10.9, 12.9 etc and replace it with the equivalent grade stainless bolt i.e. replace 8.8 with grade 80. It is not always wise to go for a higher grade assuming more tensile strength is better. A higher grade bolt will have greater tensile strength but will be less tough, ( more brittle.) Although a 8.8 bolt has a lower tensile strength (800 N/mm2) than a 12.9 bolt (1200 N/mm2) it’s impact strength at at 30 Joules is double that of a 12.9 bolt. Higher strength bolts  such as 12.9 grade are also more prone to suffer sudden catastrophic failure due to hydrogen embrittlement and are not used by some car manufacturers for this reason. 

Now this is a bloke I would listen to as my neck could depend on me making the right choice when it comes to changing fasteners!Thumbs Up


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V7 Classic Black and gold is the best colour


Posted By: jpc
Date Posted: 11 Oct 2018 at 11:30
And Dave P. had it right from the start. 
 


Posted By: Dave P.
Date Posted: 11 Oct 2018 at 13:25
Thanks, JPC. It's nice to be right occasionally. Would you sign an affidavit to that effect and send it to my good lady?

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TO LIVE OUTSIDE THE LAW YOU MUST BE HONEST.

1971 V7 Special. 1972 850GT.
1970 T120 Bonnie. 2009 500 Bullet.


Posted By: Blunderbust
Date Posted: 16 Oct 2018 at 21:23
Hi and welcome, I like you have just purchased a V9 Bobber and I love it. I have 3 other bikes but love the style and how easy this bike is to ride around town. I have to admit I am in the process of changing a few bits, like the seat (MG Comfort), the back end (I hate the rear lights and the way that it sticks up), the mirrors, the end cans, and the colour. I do not like any of the colours or the sticker decals that it comes with so they are all going, the bike is stripped down just now and I am about to paint the front light casing, the tank, the side plates and the rear guard in an olive drab (the rest, frame engine etc are remaining as is). You mention the panniers, I also don't like the supplied ones so I have decided to knock up a couple of side mounted Military style webbing bags, they look really good using the purpose built Hepco and Becker mounting system. I hope to have the bike finished and back on the road at the beginning of next week, if I do I will post a couple of photo's.

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Ride Safe.


Posted By: am2222
Date Posted: 16 Oct 2018 at 23:09
hi    there     like you just bought a v9 in roamer mode bike looks great added givi screed and rear rack mg bar end mirrors   never had a guzzi before and needed something lighter than my Honda xl100 vara   only issue is suspension the std are crap so will look to upgrade    any idea whats best   Andy

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Andy v9


Posted By: red leader one
Date Posted: 17 Oct 2018 at 11:49
https://www.hagon-shocks.co.uk/" rel="nofollow - https://www.hagon-shocks.co.uk/

Seems to be popular



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