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Possible fueling issue?

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cowboy View Drop Down
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    Posted: 09 Feb 2020 at 17:43
Hi All. First ride out on my 07 1200 Sport yesterday. Please bear in mind my normal ride is a ST1300 Pan so no comparison. 2 or 3 things I noticed which may be linked or not, takes 2 or 3 pushes on the button  to start from cold, when stopped it ticks over at just over 1K and feels like it might stop and getting an occasional back fire when shutting the throttle. Are these a normal Guzzi characteristic. Otherwise it rides fine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2020 at 22:01
Tickover usually around 1100, maybe a bit less.
Popping on the overrun is not uncommon. If you hold the throttle just off tickover when slowing it usually doesn't happen.

Starting. Has a previous owner made any changes to the stepper motor air feed? Put a valve in it perhaps?
There have been problems with a high idle speed on many of these models and the cure was to put a valve in the air bleed feed to the stepper motor from the air box. The idea is to turn off the air feed when the engine is warm. Brings the idle speed down the normal.
But if left switched off it makes it difficult to start.
Jut check if you can that there is no valve in that tube run. Indeed if that tube were crushed or kinked it would also be difficult to start.
Brian.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ken-Guzzibear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 10:29
popping on overrun can be a slight air leak in exhaust any crack in rubber inlet causes issues too Had a V11 le mans did this there was a small black exhaust mark in one silencer clamp some exhaust silicon sorted that ....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cowboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 10:36
Thanks for the replies. I will have a look in the manual that I have downloaded to see where that air pipe is and how to get at it and check Brian's suggestion, will also check exhaust for leaks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 12:56
That pipe comes out of the bottom of the airbox between the pots.


Page 40.


Edited by Brian UK - 10 Feb 2020 at 13:00
Brian.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cowboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 19:31
Thanks Brian. Have sent you a PM.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Doc. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Feb 2020 at 18:51
I believe your Bike has the 5AM ECU, which means you can use GuzziDiag to make adjustments to the Fuelling Map, including Idle speed (the 'base' figure, and changes in relation to Engine Temps).
It's free to download, easy to use, all you need are a basic Laptop, and the Cables (£25-30) from Lonelec (to connect Laptop to Bike).

It's a useful tool for owners of any FI Guzzi, you can do all the regular service stuff yourself, TPS Reset, Auto-Learning Parameter reset, Lambda trim adjust, etc.
You can also load alternative Maps.
If it's never been done, then it's long overdue.

When was the Throttle-Body Synch and TPS reset last done?

Dirty Throttle Butterflies can cause low-speed running issues.
The 1200s don't like being filled to the top mark on the Dipstick, half-way between the two marks is the correct level.
If they're filled to the 'top', they'll breathe the excess into the Airbox, which then gets into the Intakes, gumming up the Butterflies.

Does it struggle to spin over when it doesn't start straight away, or does it spin nicely, but just not fire-up?



Edited by Doc. - 14 Feb 2020 at 18:56
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cowboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Feb 2020 at 20:08
Hi Doc. Thanks for the reply. I have only had the bike a couple of months and I have no idea of the service history.  Not being very tech savvy the diagnostic kit would probably be above my station. Looked on lonelec and there seem to be a few leads on there. The bike is always plugged in to the oximate charger and spins over fine. First spin no fire. Second it tries and usually third will fire up and eventually settle down then after a few minutes warming up will rev OK.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Doc. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Feb 2020 at 20:50
Can be a little daunting at first, but once you've done it a couple of times, you'll wonder why you didn't do it sooner!
It's not really any more difficult than doing the equivalent mechanical tasks, like balancing carbs, or adjusting/changing jets.

Have a read through this . . . 
http://www.thisoldtractor.com/moto_guzzi_quota_guzzidiag_howto_-_a_tutorial_for_beginners.html
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cowboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Feb 2020 at 10:05
I have been looking into this diagnostic thing and am a bit confused with the information out there. There seems to be 2 options from lonelec,  PC cables or obd bluetooth thing. Have read old tractor and downloaded the three items then asks me to unzip which my phone can't do. Just had a look under the seat and cannot see a connector as described on old tractor tutorial, eg at the back on the right, just 2 or 3 plain white connector blocks. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Feb 2020 at 10:26
I don't have Guzzidiag, but to the best of my knowledge, but as I understand it you need one USB to EOBD cable and one EOBD to Fiat adapter cable.

The three pin socket is usually beside the small fuse box (left side) under the seat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul-l Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Feb 2020 at 10:52
The lonelec cables are good, and specifically recommended with tunecu software ( not that you're using that)
This is what I've found on my CCM with lonelec cables/Bluetooth and tunecu :
I did have to make up my own adaptor to connect to the bikes socket though.
With the Bluetooth thing and certain software you won't be able to download / upload maps onto the ecu ( this is dependant on software and bike) but you will be able to monitor the ecu parameters while the engine is running. And probably do all the diagnostic tests too.
With the usb  cable however you may not be able to monitor the engine parameters while the engine is running as for some reason the connection drops repeatedly, but downloading / uploading maps, and doing diagnostic tests are fine.
Paul

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Doc. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 20:33
Originally posted by cowboy cowboy wrote:

. . . then asks me to unzip which my phone can't do. Just had a look under the seat and cannot see a connector as described on old tractor tutorial . . .


As far as I know, GuzziDiag isn't compatible with Android/iOs.
You need a LapTop.

As for the Connector, not sure on yours.
Mine (09 Stelvio) has two unconnected, black, three-socket Plugs under the Pillion Perch on the right.
The one for connecting to the ECU has only two wires to it, the other has three.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cowboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 20:54
Thanks Doc. My lad came over today and downloaded the diagnostic tool to the wife's laptop. Will have another good root around under the pillion seat to see if I can find the connector. Should be there somewhere. When/if I find it I will order the OBD kit from lonelec.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Doc. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Feb 2020 at 21:21
It's perfectly possible the Plug is in another location entirely, but hopefully it's the same type.

This is on a V11, it's the one with the yellow Seal, there's a Cap on it too, which obviously needs to come off.

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