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Calisteve View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Calisteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 13:48
Hi - question concerning gear box and rear drive oil for California 1100. The manual specifies 75ml of 80W-90 for the gear box and 23ml for the rear drive/bevel box + 2ml of Molyslip/Molykote (although I note many recommend adding the additive to the gear box as well).  

I see that 'Motul Gearbox SAE 80W90' says it is reinforced with 'Molybdenum bisulphide MOS2'.  Does that remove the need for any additional additive for both boxes i.e. will 1 litre this of its own be sufficient for both gear box and rear drive with no additional additives?

Many thanks.
Ride safe
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Calisteve View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Calisteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 14:03
Edit - I also contacted Opie oils direct and they (very promptly) confirmed it's fine for both boxes with no additional additives.  Anyone here using this oil or similar?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NevadaJohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 07:04
Steve, Those quantities look very small compared to my Nevada 750, which takes 1L of Gearbox oil and 170ml of final drive hypoid gear oil. As regards Molybdenum Sulphide I really don't see it doing any harm even if the manufacturers now all say it's not necessary. On balance, if you think it will help then put it in even if it's just for the placebo effect (which incidentally is a very powerful effect!). If you do use the Motul with Moly then be prepared for mucky looking stuff that smells "off" coming out when you drain it.
As ed says, Opie oils are always on hand to give advice on lubricants and they are very good. I now tend to use Rock Oil, which is a British Made product that seems to have consistent quality that's not too pricey. The only problem I have with Opie is that I have to order rather a lot to qualify for free shipping. 
Nevada John
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Calisteve View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Calisteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 07:07
Cheers mate - much appreciated.  I'll double check the quantities but am pretty sure they are the ones in the manual.  Thanks again.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Calisteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 07:10
Oops - decimal point issue - its .75l and .25l.  Can't get used to there new fangled metric measurements.
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NevadaJohn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote NevadaJohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2019 at 07:14
That's more like it Steve! For a moment I wondered whether you were referring to a 1/72 Airfix model!!
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Courier955 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Courier955 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2019 at 12:52
Hi Oilman...

Bike details..

Moto Guzzi
LeMans Mk2 850
1979
4 stroke V-Twin
No performance mods
Road use.

Have just ordered some Millers ZSS 4T 20w50 Semi Synth Motorcycle engine oil off you (online) and want to know if it has enough ZDDP additive in the oil already for my old engine or should I buy a zinc additive myself and add it to the oil?

Best Regards....Dan
Old Skool Roadburners………



1979 Moto Guzzi Le Mans
1972 Honda CB350K
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oilman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote oilman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Dec 2019 at 09:38
Hi Dan

Yes, it has plenty of ZDDP.

There is a lot of information going around about ZDDP which doesn't really take into account the advances in additives, improvements in basestocks and change in fuels.
Four star fuels had a negative effect on ZDDP, one of the chemicals used in four star neutralised the ZDDP content to some extent, in effect you lost about 10% of the ZDDP to the fuel. That rarely gets considered when people talk about ZDDP, they are still referring to the levels required with four star.

ZDDP additives have become more effective over the years as well, I think they are something like 10% more efficient in how they work now than back in the seventies. Also, there are other additives used as ZDDP replacements that help the ZDDP. 

Oil basestocks are now so much better than they used to be, they have a much higher film strength, so helps the ZDDP to do the job.

Yes, ZDDP is good, but you don't need as much as you used to. Basically, if you are buying a specific 'Classic' oil from a reputable manufacturer, it will have enough. A lot of them aren't keen to give out the ZDDP figure though, for instance when I spoke to Valvoline about it, their answer is that "It's just part of the additive package, there's plenty." and in fairness, they're right, I've never heard of a single issue with the VR1 being used where there has been wear due to too little ZDDP. Also, I've never heard of someone using an appropriate classic oil that have had problems related to too little ZDDP. The ones where I have come across issues are when they have bought the cheapest 20w-50 they can get their hands on, then blamed the oil for not being perfect.

Most people also don't know that too much can be harmful, increased levels can cause build ups on the spark plugs and can affect emissions systems (although that isn't really an issue in most classics). There has also been a study recently showing that increased levels can lead to increased wear, but I don't have the details to hand at the moment and can't remember the specifics.

In reality, most classic specific oils will have somewhere between 900-1200ppm ZDDP and that will be plenty for pretty much everyone (despite what some think). The high end ester synthetic racing oils contain around 1200-1400ppm ZDDP and are often a good option for performance classics, simply because they are about the best oils for out and out protection. The ZSS is not a specific classic oil or an ester based performance oil, but it does meet the API SJ spec, so it has a full dose of ZDDP.

Cheers

Tim
Use the code GUZZIRIDERS and get 10% Club Discount
Email: sales@opieoils.co.uk
Phone: 01209 202944
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rollo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Dec 2019 at 11:12
Originally posted by Calisteve Calisteve wrote:

Hi - question concerning gear box and rear drive oil for California 1100. The manual specifies 75ml of 80W-90 for the gear box and 23ml for the rear drive/bevel box + 2ml of Molyslip/Molykote (although I note many recommend adding the additive to the gear box as well).  

I see that 'Motul Gearbox SAE 80W90' says it is reinforced with 'Molybdenum bisulphide MOS2'.  Does that remove the need for any additional additive for both boxes i.e. will 1 litre this of its own be sufficient for both gear box and rear drive with no additional additives?

Many thanks.

Hi Steve, yes I have been using the Motul Gearbox oil in the gearbox and bevel for the last three years. I like that I can just buy one litre to change both boxes without additional additive. I think the gearbox runs slightly quieter in third gear too. Mark
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Courier955 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Dec 2019 at 14:15
Thankyou very much for your reply Oilman...very detailed and informative.
I will use the oil as is.

Thankyou....Dan
Old Skool Roadburners………



1979 Moto Guzzi Le Mans
1972 Honda CB350K
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