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Non-Motobatt battery for 1000 SP

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Omobono View Drop Down
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    Posted: 08 Aug 2019 at 17:30
Good afternoon everyone,
 
I have become aware last weekend that my second Motobatt battery is now basically out of combat as it refuses to start the bike after one week of inactivity. I suspect that 3-4 weeks of inactivity last month were enough to "deep discharge" the thing, as several hours of riding (say: 4 hours) were still insufficient to let the bike start one week later (it was really discharged, as in the dreaded "clac-clac-clac-clac").
 
I am now resigned to get a different battery and, this time, I would like to go with something more conventional than this "new technology" batteries.
 
I would obviously have to be sure that it fits. I would also prefer a massive cranking power if possible.  
 
What do you recommend?     
 
Thanks
 
O
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BondEquipe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BondEquipe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2019 at 19:11
Might be cheaper to get a modern clever (Optimate or similar) charger which could recover the battery?
Stephen
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Mike H View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2019 at 20:25
If you want to leave it a while disconnect the clock. Guess how I know! It's a constant parasitic drain.

What sort of riding do you normally do? Lots of slow urban type stuff with lots of waiting at traffic lights etc. is no good as the alternator doesn't charge at idle. Worse obviously if you have all the lights on as well.

I usually like to try to charge mine every couple of weeks, if not ridden (and for long enough and fast enough), I put a charger on for  hour or so then check it. Do not leave a "trickle charger" permanently connected. Optimate might be alright if it can turn itself on and off as required.


"Chicken nuggets don't dance on a Tuesday."
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Mike H View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2019 at 20:31
This is what I put in my 850 -


Note it is shorter than the battery tray so you need a good working battery strap and good working battery support side rubbers.


"Chicken nuggets don't dance on a Tuesday."
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Omobono View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Omobono Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2019 at 11:42
The clock!! The clock!!!
 
I was trying so hard to think what could be draining the battery, and could not imagine that the new electronic ignition would leak somewhere. Nothing else has changed, the heated grips have been removed.
 
The clock!!
 
How do I disconnect the b@sterd? Is it one of the cables going to the battery?
 
I do have an optimate, but an attempt at recovery with the first Motobatt failed so I thought I was screwed this time, too (I was told Motobatt does not react as well as conventional batteries to deep discharge).
 
Might as well try.
 
I am also encouraged that you battery, with "only" 240 A CCA, works well. I thought way more would be required.
 
I ride on "normal" roads with a lot of A roads, no commuting and constant stop and go. The battery works well *for the rest of the day* when it has been charging 30 minutes or so, but it does not keep the charge to the following weekend (I only ride on weekends).
 
Last Saturday I rode from the garage to the MOT place, some 15 miles away, and half a mile before the place the bike wen toff and I had the "clac-clac-clac-clac" (means: quite dead) when I tried to start the engine again. I restarted the engine with my portable starter pack, but this is what led me to think that the battery is gone....  
 
P.S. alas, no electricity in the garage! I would have to take off the battery, bring it home, recharge and try again...  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdrianW Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2019 at 14:06
I cannot suggest a replacement as my Guzi is small (V35II which seems to have an emormous battery for 350cc!).
I can however relate to the Motobatt issue. I had an expensive one on my Velo Venom (needed for electronic ignition + allternator) which only lasted a couple of years. Attempts to recover using Optimate raised the volts from 9.4 to 10.2 after many hours... It was brief, back to 9.4 in no time..

They used to be good, plenty of evidence out there that they are not so good now. I'd recommend virtually anything else !! 
I now go to my local battery supplier (Bristol Batteries) and find I get a better battery for less than web suppliers. I'm using a 12V alarm type battery on my Venom now, cost just over 12 quid..  I appreciate you need something rather heavier...  !!

Good luck,
Adrian
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Omobono View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Omobono Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2019 at 14:14
Thanks Adrian and your experience is, sadly, identical to mine with my first Motobatt: short-lived surge to 12.4 after a week of charge, dead the following week…
 
I might not waste a week trying to salvage the battery after all, or I could do it for the fun of it and keep the battery as reserve if all goes well.... 
 
Anyone has other experiences?
 
Odyssey? Yuasa? Other stuff?
 
Mike, your battery appears very inexpensive:
 
1) is it very heavy? (I might have to lug it from Hammersmith to Chafford Hundred)
2) Is it long-lived?
 
Thanks
 
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Ken-Guzzibear View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ken-Guzzibear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2019 at 18:59
on older bikes the charging system is not set up for agm or any other battery than the oem type lead acid one ....you have the choice look at Tayna for list of oem type batteries that will fit, OR search out a solid state variable volts reg and alter it from standard 13.8v for lead acid battery to the 14.3 required by agm type battery 
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Mike H View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2019 at 00:15
Originally posted by Omobono Omobono wrote:

How do I disconnect the b@sterd? Is it one of the cables going to the battery?


Pull fuse number 6. Assuming it's wired up as standard.


Quote
but it does not keep the charge to the following weekend (I only ride on weekends).
Last Saturday I rode from the garage to the MOT place, some 15 miles away, and half a mile before the place the bike wen toff and I had the "clac-clac-clac-clac" (means: quite dead) when I tried to start the engine again. I restarted the engine with my portable starter pack, but this is what led me to think that the battery is gone....  


Does seem like it's shagged.

Silly question - I suppose the Voltmeter does behave normally, and show charging Voltage?



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Mike H View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2019 at 00:17
PS: what Ken said

"Chicken nuggets don't dance on a Tuesday."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdrianW Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2019 at 07:58
My Venom has a modern Alton generator and podtronics reg/rec unit so it wasn't that, simply a poor battery.

I bought a Motobatt for my Buell XB9S many years ago as I needed one that lies down almost horizontally (lead acid ones are not good at that!). It has suffered neglect and abuse (the battery, not the bike!) and still works.. I rest my case.

Not arguing re the charging circuit age but I thought they'd been 14.3 for some time now...

Cheers,

Adrian
Bristol UK
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Omobono View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Omobono Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2019 at 14:03
Hi,
yes the voltmeter shows the usual behaviour, charging as I ride (much less with lights on; during the day, I tend to leave the lights off to facilitate the charging of the battery).

I seem to understand that the Motobatt battery was never the right choice for the bike? Still, the battery kicked like a mule when charged (the "difference" at start was obvious: really kicking the starter engine in the behind); therefore, I thought I had a winner there.. 


Edited by Omobono - 10 Aug 2019 at 14:06
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Omobono View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Omobono Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2019 at 14:09
Re: fuses, what I will do is to pull the fuses one at a time until I see that the clock stops. It will be a bit of a bitch as I think it has no seconds...

But then a second question: if I mount a conventional, acid battery as Tonti intended, will I need to disconnect the clock? It seems difficult to believe that clock is able to discharge a big battery in three weeks?

Still: I don't need the clock: I have the exact time from the Garmin satnav, that I always have on when I ride (I think no draining of batteries at all when it's off, though...). 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2019 at 17:55
All AGM type batteries will suffer badly if deeply discharged. The other problem is their lower capacity which means the discharge more quickly.
Brian.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Omobono Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Aug 2019 at 11:35
Update: I have installed a Yuasa battery I had not utilised at home (bought for the BMW and then never used). Seems to work fine even if CCA at some 230 is actually not so high. It is a conventional acid battery.
I tried to find the clock fuse but the new electronic ignition only has four fuses; pulling the first three did not stop the clock, the fourth was a damaged 30A fuse I was afraid to break so I left it untouched (more fuses on order), but I can't imagine a clock needs a 30A fuse. 
 
   
 
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