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More electricary on the G5

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ageingroover62 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 08 Apr 2018 at 15:57
Welcome to the next instalment of the ongoing G5 saga, having got the bike up and running and having used it every day this week i decided to give it a clean which at one stage involved "muck off" and a light sprinkling of water to wash it off, having dried it off and left it running for a while off i went to fill up with fuel.
Having done so i started the bike no problem and got about 10 feet when it cut out and would not restart, all instrument and lights working but no spark.
The problem  is its been rewired and had electronic ign installed and a modern fusebox by someone who knew what they were doing which is more than i do.
Where to start? no spark to the plugs, but everything else appears to be working. 
Can someone talk me thro a step by step as to what to check please
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Mike H View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2018 at 17:18
I presume "light sprinkling of water" means a hose pipe?

What make is the electronic ignition?

I have had water spray get into a Rita amplifier box, but to be fair was extremely wet weather over a whole weekend, to Manchester and back, and was very forceful spray.




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ageingroover62 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ageingroover62 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2018 at 17:29
No idea what the make is of the electronic ign is Mike cant see any markings, yes hosepipe was used but tried not to wet ign or reg/rect, do you think there's likely to be a fuse some where that ive missed ? at the time it happend when i checked the fuses two were blown {blue} but i dont know if they had just gone, replaced them but no change and they havent blown again.
ive got a couple of photos of the dist if i can work out how to post them 
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ageingroover62 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ageingroover62 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2018 at 18:03
Upon further investigation the alloy box of gubins on the nearside of the bike under the side cover has the following on the inside where its difficult to see "Lucas AB11 electronic ign amplifier  47270B" so presumably the dissy is the same make, the reg/rect appears to be the standard.
The Lucas box is well sealed and theres no sign of water on the outside, is it possible theres a fuse inside?
I was wondering if its possible to start at the plugs and work back to see if i can trace a fault but i dont know where to go from there
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote c13pep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2018 at 20:12
Check out the other thread for a T5, same problem (no spark)
CHRIS
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Ken-Guzzibear View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ken-Guzzibear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2018 at 20:44
the rita has a plug usually where seat tank join under it any damp gets in they will not start had that with my V1000 at a rally, got it started after taking connector apart and cleaning it blowing it dry ...did not take the hint, did seal with silicon BUT it failed on M% on the way back from Minehead. went back to points as never had them fail in 200k miles ......Rita is hard on the battery and on the coils ..... no spark check fuses check connection if that fails check coils.....unlike old points that warn you well before failure Rita just goes dead
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Ken-Guzzibear View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ken-Guzzibear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Apr 2018 at 20:51
lots of info on eurospares how to test and set up rita .....some adore it I tried it ...it failed a few times .... not worth the bloody hassle in my opinion... mine runs way better on points better pick up top end etc .... had mine die due to a wee bit of damp in the connector block then die completely .... very hard on the battery and system no way around a failure on the road I did way too many miles to put up with it .....
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Mike H View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 16:28
Yep water can get in past the cable grommet, that's how it got in mine, take it off take the lid off and have a look inside, was half an egg cup full in the one that failed on the Manchester trip. Ouch

Dried it out over a radiator overnight, was OK again.


Originally posted by ageingroover62 ageingroover62 wrote:


so presumably the dissy is the same make,

No is mostly stock factory (Marelli) fitment but the circular plate is replaced with Rita item with the pick-up on it. Also involves the cam shaft and bob weights being removed and replaced with the Rita rotor.

HTH

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ageingroover62 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ageingroover62 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Apr 2018 at 17:49
Had the front off the amplifier but there is no sign of water ingress, ive downloaded info from both AO servises and eurospares on Rita fault finding but i have only the vaguest grasp of what im doing and although both are in some detail im floundering.
Since the bike was running okay immediately after cleaning for a while i find it hard to believe that the gap in the pickup has suddenly changed so im discounting that, have tried spark plug against head and turning ign on and off as suggested with no spark showing.
they both say test the coils but the description as to how is difficult to understand, is there an easy way to follow a path from ignition switch forwards to see where the breakdown is? and an easy way to test coils?
I BLOODY HATE ELECTRICS !!! 
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Brian UK View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Apr 2018 at 12:38
Basically with the Rita, when you turn off the ignition you should get a spark. If you don't see a spark then check the coils. These are usually two 6v coils in series, and so if one fails you lose sparks both sides. Have you any means to check the resistance of the coil primaries?
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Mike H View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Apr 2018 at 14:52
On the other forum someone suggests could be coil failure, most often Rita has 2 x 6V coils in series, so if one is open circuit, both spark plugs will be affected simultaneously. (Not work)

Have you got a multimeter? Would be easy then to check if 12V is present on the coils, one will be about 12V, the other about 6V, i.e. at the junction between the two.

HTH



Edited by Mike H - 10 Apr 2018 at 14:56
"Chicken nuggets don't dance on a Tuesday."
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Mike H View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Apr 2018 at 14:55
PS: you also mentioned finding two blown fuses, have you found out what these fuses are for yet?

Personally I think it's a power supply problem, and not the Rita system at all.

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ageingroover62 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ageingroover62 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Apr 2018 at 18:11
Ive had the new starter/cut out switch apart toniight and there was a bit of water in there also more in the supposed waterproof connector further down the line so hair dryer out and given them a good dry, sods law now the starter switch wont work so will have to have another go tomorrow night, the coils are 6volt as suggested so will work my way from the starter.
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ageingroover62 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ageingroover62 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2018 at 19:07
We have lift off is was the kill switch, ironic that it was the newest part on the whole bike, it was the multipoint connection halfway down the cable that was the main culprit, it was a pattern part (should have stuck to guzzi leggo !!!
Many thanks to all who contributed to my saga
Dave
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Ken-Guzzibear View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ken-Guzzibear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Apr 2018 at 19:19
well done another one "sorted" ....I found it sensible to use a thin smear of silicon on the 12/3/15 way connectors so they seal I also put a very thin smear on the switchgear joints. mind mine has Yam switchgear on it .... the newer bikes use the same connectors as other jap and German vehicles much better than the 70's stuff Well done sorting it mate Elektrikery can be very frustrating
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