G5 owner on suicide watch! |
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FlyingTiger
Senior Member Joined: 22 Sep 2018 Location: BRISTOL Status: Offline Points: 195 |
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Posted: 19 Feb 2019 at 22:10 |
Gents,
I have spent probably 20 hours trying to sort my perishing electrics out but am prostrating myself before your collective wisdom and am now pleading for your help! Ok dramatics over but i have genuinely tried my best to resolve it. I am not a sparks expert but have always worked things out in the end, but not this time, at least so far anyway. You may recall it had a twin headlamp fairing when i bought it and also had extra indicators and fogs on the panniers. I stripped the fairing and additional electrics off and put the loom back to drawing.....well clearly not quite! The list of symptoms are as below; IGNITION OFF 1.hazard switch operates rear flashers and hi beam dash light flashes 2. Left indicator switch operates left rear and both front flashers. Also left dash warning light and hi beam dash lights, both flashing. 3. Right indicator switch gives same as (2) but right rear flasher instead or left. 4. Pilot light switch operates the pilot light, both flasher and hi beam warning lights and the rear light 5, main light switch on gives no lights but the indicators will work properly but with an assortment of warning lights IGNITION SWITCHED ON 1. same symptoms as 1-3 above 2. Same as 4 but with headlamp warning light showing 3. Lights fully switched on gives all lights (both front beams very dim), and all 4 indicators glowing solidly I can't figure out how power is getting to the system without the ignition on. Curing that would probabl cure most issues i think. I have checked and re checked the wiring so many times i can no longer see the wires from the trees so any suggestions would be most welcomed. Your time in consideration of my problem would be much appreciated and probably allow me to put my belt and shoelaces back on! Thanks in advance for any help guys Best regards, mark
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Mark Serj
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Ianboydsnr
Senior Member Joined: 14 May 2014 Location: Cumbria Status: Offline Points: 831 |
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sounds like an earth problem,
Some circuits are powered without the ignition switched on, so don’t worry about that Hazards, Rear brake light, Pilot lights Possibly the indicators It will backfeed circuits from the brake light as well Try earthing the front indicators directly, that is open the indicator and earth direct to the fitting.
Edited by Ianboydsnr - 19 Feb 2019 at 22:35 |
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Dave P.
Senior Member Joined: 12 Jan 2015 Location: Northants Status: Offline Points: 5573 |
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Can't help with the wiring I'm afraid but I do appreciate the gallows humour.
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TO LIVE OUTSIDE THE LAW YOU MUST BE HONEST.
1971 V7 Special. 1972 850GT. 1970 T120 Bonnie. 2009 500 Bullet. |
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FlyingTiger
Senior Member Joined: 22 Sep 2018 Location: BRISTOL Status: Offline Points: 195 |
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Thanks Ian, Can I ask what feedback from the brake circuit means please? I will try the direct earthing idea tonight. Cheers Mark
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Mark Serj
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Brian UK
Moderator Group Joined: 13 May 2014 Location: Surrey Status: Offline Points: 17641 |
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This does sound like an earth problem. Check all your earths to the frame and make sure they are clean and bright. Then add some grease to stop the rust. Check the indicators have a good earth, and the rear light cliuster too. There is also an earth to the dash area. This can often be the cause of odd problems. Once you have gone through all that, come back and tell us what still doesn't work, and we'll all come and remove your belt and shoelaces permanently.
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Brian.
Better 5 minutes late in this world than years early in the next. |
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FlyingTiger
Senior Member Joined: 22 Sep 2018 Location: BRISTOL Status: Offline Points: 195 |
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Ha ha thanks Brian!
I have resorted to wearing slip ons and elasticated waistband trousers.....nice! My frame has been powder coated but I made sure I had earth points masked off as am aware of the new paint / no earth scenario. I guess there may be 'natural' (i.e. no wires) earth points that I may have over looked so will review all of these possibilities tonight......might put the bubbly on ice for later.....! Cheers for now
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Mark Serj
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FlyingTiger
Senior Member Joined: 22 Sep 2018 Location: BRISTOL Status: Offline Points: 195 |
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BTW just thinking about it, if some of the circuits didn't have an earth, wouldn't they not work? E.G the 4 indicators glowing with the lights on - wouldn't this mean they are getting power from the lighting circuit somehow?
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Mark Serj
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Brian UK
Moderator Group Joined: 13 May 2014 Location: Surrey Status: Offline Points: 17641 |
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They should earth through the stem and to the frame. Check there is an earth path to the frame. |
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Brian.
Better 5 minutes late in this world than years early in the next. |
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Jools
Senior Member Joined: 19 Aug 2016 Location: Milton Keynes Status: Offline Points: 273 |
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It's an earthing problem for sure - guess how I know?!
I gave up using the frame as an earthing point years ago, it's just too flaky. Ever since then I've run a separate earth to EVERYTHING on all my bikes (mostly ancient Brits), going right back to the negative terminal on the battery (or rather the positive for the Triumph and Royal Oilfields). A few more wires certainly, but the electrics have been 100% - even the lights dispense more than a warm brown puddle on the road! BTW - those bikes I've kept with the standard 6-volt system have had their wires uprated to x 2 the original core diameter. This alone gives x 4 less resistance, a significant factor when dealing with such small voltages.
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Jools
V1000G5 1972 T150V 1961 Royal Enfield Constellation 1971 Suzuki ACC50 erm... 1963 Philips Panda (and other assorted detritus) |
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FlyingTiger
Senior Member Joined: 22 Sep 2018 Location: BRISTOL Status: Offline Points: 195 |
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Careful guys, I'm starting to feel positive.....scuse the pun!!
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Mark Serj
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Ianboydsnr
Senior Member Joined: 14 May 2014 Location: Cumbria Status: Offline Points: 831 |
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back feeding is where two circuits are connected together after the switch, like the two brake light switches are, the front feed is from the dash area and key operated, so if you press the foot brake, then the hand brake, circuits connected to the dash feed will energise,
As I said, connect a fly lead from the negative to the side of the bulb, if your earth is missing then it should work, |
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Ianboydsnr
Senior Member Joined: 14 May 2014 Location: Cumbria Status: Offline Points: 831 |
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M
The power is trying to return to Earth, it’s travelling through the bulbs of the indicators to earth, because difficult though that is, it’s the best earth it has, and the bulbs are simply a resistance, if the resistance was higher, the indicators wouldn’t work, but neither would the headlight It’s probably a bad earth to the headlamp area, and at a guess its back feeding the indicators through the earth cluster of wires that work the indicator display and headlight display on the dash, to the four indicators and then onto earth. These are ideal for troubleshooting earth issues, You connect to the battery and you can have power or earth at the point, and its protected, so you can’t let the smoke out.
Edited by Ianboydsnr - 20 Feb 2019 at 16:24 |
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FlyingTiger
Senior Member Joined: 22 Sep 2018 Location: BRISTOL Status: Offline Points: 195 |
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I was right with you up to the second use of the word earth........!!
Joking aside, I will be earthing the living daylights out of it tonight....keep an ear open for whoop whoops!!!
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Mark Serj
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Chris950s
Senior Member Joined: 03 Nov 2018 Location: Essex Status: Online Points: 378 |
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When I had my frame powder coated before about 30 years ago, I made all earths via wires to engine or gearbox. I have node points in the headlamp shell that connect to the 15 pin plug and from there to another node point near the coils and new relays, this connects to the top of the gearbox under the battery and connects everything aft of that including the main earth from the battery to the frame. Main earth wires are quite thick. Never had any earthing problems after that.
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Chris and Karen - Essex
2011 Stelvio NTX, 1974 950S (750S replica nearly rebuilt!), 1966 Triumph T100SS 58 years young this year! |
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FlyingTiger
Senior Member Joined: 22 Sep 2018 Location: BRISTOL Status: Offline Points: 195 |
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whoop whoop!,!.,!
One earthing wire from the headlamp shell bringing together the pilot, headlight and dash lights to earth on the frame and it ALL WORKS! At least i got the loom rebuild right! A thousand thanks guys. A great lesson for future restos. So kind of you all to take the time to help. What a great forum. No where did i hide those laces and my belt as these slip ons and elasticated trousers are so last century??!!!
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Mark Serj
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