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motogadget and ignition amplifiers

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Chabs View Drop Down
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    Posted: 16 Sep 2019 at 19:23
can someone please explain to a non electrically minded person exactly what the Bosch ignition amplifiers actually do ?? i'm trying to install a motogadget basic unit, and was wondering what they do and how the unit can or will effect . thanks in advance .

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iansoady View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iansoady Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 2019 at 09:50
Essentially they take a signal from the ignition pickups and convert it into a pulse for the coils. As well as that they deliver the ignition advance "curve".

I'm not sure what the motogadget is, perhaps you could provide a link?
Ian
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ken-Guzzibear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 2019 at 11:45
Not sure about motogadget but if unsure get a specialist to do it i do know you can fry these ign boxes on a small block ....Vehicle elektrikery is a dark art and can catch the un initiated causing real expensive issues very quickly 
The Older i Get, The Better I Was
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 2019 at 16:07
I don't think the Bosch units as fitted to the V50 are CDI, they use a transistor to switch the current through the coils instead of opening points.

I don't know the Motogadget either so can't comment on that.
Brian.

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Chabs View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chabs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2019 at 07:47
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2019 at 08:07
Reading that description, can't see how any ignition system would be affected. It's not connected in any way to the ignition, just a glorified lighting control.
Brian.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iansoady Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2019 at 15:54
That looks to me like a solution searching for a problem......
Ian
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian UK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2019 at 18:47
I think the clue is in the name, motogadget.
Brian.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Oldrat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2019 at 20:04
Checkout ‘Steve Hallam’ on Facebook. He may answer a question on messenger?

He’s an electrical wiz and regularly fits M Units and is a top man to boot. Had three Guzzis in his workshop for airing last time I was there.
He’s based in Croydon though which makes a personal visit a long trip.

Nowt wrong with Motogadget stuff.  Another resource is Revival motorcycles on You tube. They have several vids explaining most of the MotoGadget stuff and even some troubleshooting.  They say that they respond to email questions too.

Members here seem to be still in the dark ages with all this electikery and interwebery stuff 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ben. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2019 at 20:50
Hello Chabs, I gather you are restoring a Monza that has been standing a while, I ran one in the Eighties and found it a delightful machine.
Being a nosey beggar, I was wondering what your plan is, what needs doing, and why you favour an after market electrical device over the original equipment.
Mine worked very well as standard, and my experience is that one needs to know more than the manufacturer if you are going to start altering things, and be able to rejig the wiring looms and create your own system.
That's quite a lot of extra work?
If you are doing a complete rewire however, there are opportunities to improve on the original.
In the Eighties the Monza was the bees knees, now it's a restoration project.
I know how it feels ...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chabs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2019 at 18:25
Yes. 17 yrs stood... replacing carbs .  I'm installing a motogadget basic unit for lights and such. Handle bar switches to be replaced with POSH ones . 
Cafe racer style rear end. But keeping original handle bars.. 
Headlight has to be replaced as it was broken... shame as I really like it... 
I'm considering removing the ignition amplifiers and replacing with a sachse ignition kit.. a little pricey but I suppose it makes it more reliable in the ignition side of things.. I've speak with Danial off the bike shed.. and getting quite a bit of info.. see " the best wedding present ever ".. bike shed. 
Its costing a small fortune .. however this little thing has gotten into my blood.. just makes me happy when I'm working on her. .. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ben. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2019 at 18:50
Take this with a pinch of salt Chabs, 'cos I'm not an electrically minded person either, but I'm thinking that if you build a non standard machine, you need to understand at least as much as the original designer.
Partly because anything less is a bit dodgy, and partly because the large body of knowledge amassed about the bike will be irrelevant in your bike's case.
And like me, you're on a learning curve I think ...
I wish you every success whichever route you take, only you know the right one, but one is much easier, and more accessible than the other.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redmunk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2019 at 23:17
The small block electricals are odd to say the least, with no obvious reason for design choices so the Motogadget seems like a much better way to do things.

For example, originally the headlight dipped beam is switched at full current by the handlebar switch (exposed to the elements) but the flash button uses a relay...which makes no sense. Likewise, the little contacts in the ignition switch are responsible for passing current to the entire bike.

I’ve modified my V35 with a hefty relay which switches power to the whole bike, so very little current flows through the ignition switch. The headlight relay circuit has been reversed, so the relay handles the main beam and flasher goes via the button. Brighter, more reliable headlight and no risk of melted contacts. 

Nowadays there’s a lot better ways to do things, and you don’t necessarily need to know more than the designer. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iansoady Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 2019 at 10:24
I agree the electrics are somewhat iffy especially the handlebar switches. I've changed my left side one for a Yamaha (IIRC) cluster which (apart from having different coloured wires) is a much sounder bit of kit. I'm still not altogether happy about the other side but as the twistgrip is integrated it's harder to find an alternative that looks OK.

I still think the motogadget is an expensive way of avoiding a few relays and will still need a lot of thought to use it effectively.
Ian
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1986 Honda XBR500
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote c13pep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 2019 at 10:33
Whilst you can argue there are better ways to do things these days for me the thing that seems to be forgotten is that these bikes have happily performed in all weathers and climates for 30 - 40 years. In my case usually with original switchgear and wiring, only where the electrics have been tinkered with have I had problems. I do complain about things on my bikes but in the case of the V50s I have to temper that against how much service they have given and long may they continue to do so.

CHRIS
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